Rant continues

Post by Frank
Just got our monthly bill, no adjustment for service loss (Peacock and
Netflix) and they charged us $100 for service call that they ordered
without our asking for it which both them and service man said would be
no charge. Must have taken Mrs. Frank an hour and a half on the phone to
get corrected. Hopefully all is straightened out and she just got an
email that said they did.

1 hour on the phone? She's so much more intimidating than me.

Last time it took me three hours, and the crap is still not straightened
out.

Char Jackson

2023-11-25 02:12:50 UTC

1 hour on the phone? She's so much more intimidating than me.
Last time it took me three hours, and the crap is still not straightened
out.

Maybe Mrs. Frank can take on clients. She seems to get results.

Frank

2023-11-25 12:24:20 UTC

Post by Char Jackson

1 hour on the phone? She's so much more intimidating than me.
Last time it took me three hours, and the crap is still not straightened
out.

Maybe Mrs. Frank can take on clients. She seems to get results.

Sorry to hear it is just as bad for others dealing with Comcast. In the
end we did not get the services we should and this was just the last
call to correct their screw up.

I had tried three previous times with no avail after Netflix cut me off.

The woman yesterday wanted to talk to me to see if she could resolve
Netflix and I told her that the others there including the technician
that came here could not do it and I'll be damned if I was going to
spend another hour with same result. All they need to do is have a pw
with my user name for log in.

Retirednoguilt

2023-11-25 17:17:09 UTC

Post by Frank

Post by Char Jackson

1 hour on the phone? She's so much more intimidating than me.
Last time it took me three hours, and the crap is still not straightened
out.

Maybe Mrs. Frank can take on clients. She seems to get results.

Sorry to hear it is just as bad for others dealing with Comcast. In the
end we did not get the services we should and this was just the last
call to correct their screw up.
I had tried three previous times with no avail after Netflix cut me off.
The woman yesterday wanted to talk to me to see if she could resolve
Netflix and I told her that the others there including the technician
that came here could not do it and I'll be damned if I was going to
spend another hour with same result. All they need to do is have a pw
with my user name for log in.

One of several Comcast screw-ups we've had was when our condo's bulk
contract went from a double play (TV + Internet) to a triple play (TV +
Internet + Home phone). The home phone plan provides unlimited calling
throughout the US and Canada. Prior to that, we'd had a stand-alone
home phone plan with Comcast that only provided unlimited wide local
area calling because we almost never make what used to be called toll
calls and the plan we chose cost far less than paying surcharges for
each toll call we did make. As Comcast was willing to add on our phone
contract to our old bulk contract account, we paid much less for the
phone line that any alternative carrier. Comcast assured us that our
transition would be seamless and that on the day the new bulk contract
took effect, our add-on contract would terminate and we would
automatically be able to make unlimited phone calls throughout the US
and Canada without any surcharge.

Bottom line: it took 5 weeks, because no one seemed to know how to do
the changeover or said they knew how but didn't have the authority to do
it! Despite multiple levels of "escalation", no joy. I finally filed a
consumer complaint with our state's Public Service Commission. They
took action and not long after, I got a phone call from our regional
vice president of Comcast. The next day, the changeover was made. It
turns out all it took was editing one of the many codes that tell
Comcast's computers which services to provide on each subscriber's account.

I suspect your problem with getting Netflix and Peacock was also just a
matter to ensuring that the appropriate codes were associated with your
account. From what I hear, all the telecoms rate poorly for customer
service. We used to use Verizon at our previous home and never needed
customer service, either for our old copper line phone line or our fiber
optic fios internet service. However, it was a struggle to convince
Verizon to let me retain my analog phone line after we got fios. They
claimed that I needed to change to digital phone service. I said that
if I had not signed up for fios, they wouldn't be pushing for the
digital phone line. They said the only way they could do what I wanted
was to open a second account for me and send me two separate bills. My
reaction was "so? Does that take up so much room on your computers?"
They did me a "big favor" and opened the second account. My reason was
that our area experienced frequent and sometimes multi-day power
failures and even so we had never lost our analog dial tone in more than
25 years at that address. I knew that wasn't the case with digital
service. However, I've heard that my customer service experience with
Verizon was the exception and not usually the case.

Frank

2023-11-25 18:12:48 UTC

Post by Frank

Post by Char Jackson

1 hour on the phone? She's so much more intimidating than me.
Last time it took me three hours, and the crap is still not straightened
out.

Maybe Mrs. Frank can take on clients. She seems to get results.

Sorry to hear it is just as bad for others dealing with Comcast. In the
end we did not get the services we should and this was just the last
call to correct their screw up.
I had tried three previous times with no avail after Netflix cut me off.
The woman yesterday wanted to talk to me to see if she could resolve
Netflix and I told her that the others there including the technician
that came here could not do it and I'll be damned if I was going to
spend another hour with same result. All they need to do is have a pw
with my user name for log in.

One of several Comcast screw-ups we've had was when our condo's bulk
contract went from a double play (TV + Internet) to a triple play (TV +
Internet + Home phone). The home phone plan provides unlimited calling
throughout the US and Canada. Prior to that, we'd had a stand-alone
home phone plan with Comcast that only provided unlimited wide local
area calling because we almost never make what used to be called toll
calls and the plan we chose cost far less than paying surcharges for
each toll call we did make. As Comcast was willing to add on our phone
contract to our old bulk contract account, we paid much less for the
phone line that any alternative carrier. Comcast assured us that our
transition would be seamless and that on the day the new bulk contract
took effect, our add-on contract would terminate and we would
automatically be able to make unlimited phone calls throughout the US
and Canada without any surcharge.
Bottom line: it took 5 weeks, because no one seemed to know how to do
the changeover or said they knew how but didn't have the authority to do
it! Despite multiple levels of "escalation", no joy. I finally filed a
consumer complaint with our state's Public Service Commission. They
took action and not long after, I got a phone call from our regional
vice president of Comcast. The next day, the changeover was made. It
turns out all it took was editing one of the many codes that tell
Comcast's computers which services to provide on each subscriber's account.
I suspect your problem with getting Netflix and Peacock was also just a
matter to ensuring that the appropriate codes were associated with your
account. From what I hear, all the telecoms rate poorly for customer
service. We used to use Verizon at our previous home and never needed
customer service, either for our old copper line phone line or our fiber
optic fios internet service. However, it was a struggle to convince
Verizon to let me retain my analog phone line after we got fios. They
claimed that I needed to change to digital phone service. I said that
if I had not signed up for fios, they wouldn't be pushing for the
digital phone line. They said the only way they could do what I wanted
was to open a second account for me and send me two separate bills. My
reaction was "so? Does that take up so much room on your computers?"
They did me a "big favor" and opened the second account. My reason was
that our area experienced frequent and sometimes multi-day power
failures and even so we had never lost our analog dial tone in more than
25 years at that address. I knew that wasn't the case with digital
service. However, I've heard that my customer service experience with
Verizon was the exception and not usually the case.

We have their triple play and it was funny in having to tell the Comcast
installer how to connect to existing lines.

When FIOS came in ,prior to getting triple play I had Verizon copper for
home and business lines, they hooked me up to home fiber. We had to pay
old land line prices with extra long distance service. Annoying but a
consulting client paid for my business line.

Now with triple play I dropped both Verizon FIOS connections but could
easily switch between them and Comcast but I hear they are far worse to
deal with.

Char Jackson

2023-11-26 00:25:14 UTC

On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 12:17:09 -0500, Retirednoguilt

Post by Retirednoguilt
One of several Comcast screw-ups we've had was when our condo's bulk
contract went from a double play (TV + Internet) to a triple play (TV +
Internet + Home phone). The home phone plan provides unlimited calling
throughout the US and Canada. Prior to that, we'd had a stand-alone
home phone plan with Comcast that only provided unlimited wide local
area calling because we almost never make what used to be called toll
calls and the plan we chose cost far less than paying surcharges for
each toll call we did make. As Comcast was willing to add on our phone
contract to our old bulk contract account, we paid much less for the
phone line that any alternative carrier. Comcast assured us that our
transition would be seamless and that on the day the new bulk contract
took effect, our add-on contract would terminate and we would
automatically be able to make unlimited phone calls throughout the US
and Canada without any surcharge.

When I needed non-mobile phone service at home, I used Google Voice, which is
free. You need an ATA ($) and any landline phone ($), but after that all calls
are free. I ported in an old mobile number that some of my friends and family
were still using to reach me. The only limitation I ran into was that any single
call was limited to 180 minutes. When I had conference calls that lasted longer
than that, I just had to dial in again.

Larry

2023-11-26 14:47:36 UTC

Post by Char Jackson
On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 12:17:09 -0500, Retirednoguilt

When gaggle and pewtube started censoring and burying search results,
I switched my phone to a carrier that still supports the 1st Amendment.

"Do no harm" my ass.

Retirednoguilt

2023-11-26 16:31:46 UTC

Post by Char Jackson
On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 12:17:09 -0500, Retirednoguilt

I tried using Google Voice at one time to save toll charges on domestic
calls. Too frustrating because many of the family and friends I called
didn't pick up because they didn't recognize the caller ID. I always
left a message and told them to please call back on my usual landline
which I provided as part of my message. However, when many of them
called back, they'd call the Google Voice number but usually my PC was
off so no one picked up their call-back. I had more success when I
needed to make a toll call to a business or a government office. Those
numbers usually picked up or were more attentive to my request to return
my call on my usual landline. That obviously says something about many
of my friends and family members!

Char Jackson

2023-11-26 19:19:03 UTC

On Sun, 26 Nov 2023 11:31:46 -0500, Retirednoguilt

Post by Char Jackson
On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 12:17:09 -0500, Retirednoguilt

I'm guessing you didn't port your number, the number that your family and
friends would recognize, to your GV account. That would have solved that
problem.

Post by Retirednoguilt
I always
left a message and told them to please call back on my usual landline
which I provided as part of my message. However, when many of them
called back, they'd call the Google Voice number but usually my PC was
off so no one picked up their call-back.

There's no PC involved, so I don't understand that aspect of the story. Think of
the ATA as a bridge between Ethernet and phone line, so when they call your GV
number the phone(s) connected to your ATA will ring. For a while, I had all of
the phones in the house connected and able to ring on a GV call, but later I
only allowed my office phone to ring. Either way works, and again, no PC is
involved.

Post by Retirednoguilt
I had more success when I
needed to make a toll call to a business or a government office. Those
numbers usually picked up or were more attentive to my request to return
my call on my usual landline. That obviously says something about many
of my friends and family members!

If you connect everything correctly, no callers have any idea that GV is
involved. To the caller, it looks and works like any other phone.

Retirednoguilt

2023-11-27 14:01:28 UTC

Post by Char Jackson
On Sun, 26 Nov 2023 11:31:46 -0500, Retirednoguilt

Post by Char Jackson
On Sat, 25 Nov 2023 12:17:09 -0500, Retirednoguilt

I'm guessing you didn't port your number, the number that your family and
friends would recognize, to your GV account. That would have solved that
problem.

If you connect everything correctly, no callers have any idea that GV is
involved. To the caller, it looks and works like any other phone.

Sorry, I don't know what an "ATA" is. Furthermore, I used to get a slew
of spam/robocalls to my GV phone number that far exceeded how many I
received on my landline. (Google must have sold its GV listings to the
highest bidders because I never called shady numbers on either my
landline or GV number and never gave out my GV phone number to anyone.)
In any case, I would not have wanted the hookup you suggest because
although it would have solved the issue I described (and thank you for
making the suggestion and describing the hookup), I make too few toll
calls to compensate for the additional nuisance of all the trash calls
to my GV if they were ported over and ringing my landline phone. (This
was back in the days when I still had a plain copper wire analog phone
line and no capacity to use NOMOROBO or similar services.)

Now, I use NOMOROBO with home landline phones that enable me to mute the
first ring of all incoming calls. NOMOROBO takes care of almost all the
unwanted calls and I'm not even bothered by the otherwise annoying first
ring before NOMOROBO intercepts and blocks the call.

Adam H. Kerman

2023-11-27 19:07:07 UTC

. . .

Sorry, I don't know what an "ATA" is.

Analogue telephone adapter

Many (but not all) digital voice services use SIP. Generally, you need a
telephone instrument that incorporates SIP or an ATA for use with an
existing analogue telephone instrument.

Post by Retirednoguilt
Furthermore, I used to get a slew
of spam/robocalls to my GV phone number that far exceeded how many I
received on my landline. (Google must have sold its GV listings to the
highest bidders because I never called shady numbers on either my
landline or GV number and never gave out my GV phone number to anyone.)

That's not how it works.

Post by Retirednoguilt
In any case, I would not have wanted the hookup you suggest because
although it would have solved the issue I described (and thank you for
making the suggestion and describing the hookup), I make too few toll
calls to compensate for the additional nuisance of all the trash calls
to my GV if they were ported over and ringing my landline phone. (This
was back in the days when I still had a plain copper wire analog phone
line and no capacity to use NOMOROBO or similar services.)

Er no. My suggestion was porting your existing phone number into Google
Voice. You don't wish to receive calls on the number provided with
your Google Voice service so you didn't need to keep that number.

Post by Retirednoguilt
Now, I use NOMOROBO with home landline phones that enable me to mute the
first ring of all incoming calls. NOMOROBO takes care of almost all the
unwanted calls and I'm not even bothered by the otherwise annoying first
ring before NOMOROBO intercepts and blocks the call.

That service was long thwarted by false CID.

Retirednoguilt

2023-11-27 19:40:50 UTC

. . .

Sorry, I don't know what an "ATA" is.

Analogue telephone adapter
Many (but not all) digital voice services use SIP. Generally, you need a
telephone instrument that incorporates SIP or an ATA for use with an
existing analogue telephone instrument.

You did it again. What is "SIP"?

That's not how it works.

That's not how what works? Are you trying to say that all
span/robocalls are made by automatic random dialers? There's no black
market out there any more for curated lists of verified numbers and no
legitimate business can sell its customer/subscriber phone lists because
the market for those lists has disappeared?

I don't understand the consequences of doing that. Would that route all
calls to my land line to GV instead or redundantly with having those
incoming calls go to both my land line circuit and GV concurrently? If
to GV voice account exclusively, that would have been a disaster as I
only connected to GV on my desktop PC once or twice/month for the time
it took to make a call and otherwise was not logged in. Besides, my PC
is off much more than on. If instead the call was routed to both
concurrently, would the call have been picked up by my home answering
machine (when I had analog landline I used a stand alone answering
machine or by GV's voice mail?

Just trying to understand how this would have worked. Of course it's
moot since moving to current home and having voice over internet digital
phone line.

That service was long thwarted by false CID.

Maybe so but not in my experience. When I go to my Comcast Voice
calling activity log on line, I usually see at least 4-8 unfamiliar
incoming calls of fewer than 15 seconds duration every day that never
appear on my phone's handset screen (that shows the previous 50 incoming
calls). In fact, many days, my phone never rings at all but the Comcast
log shows numerous incoming calls on that day. Maybe once every 5-10
days I'll get one junk call ring through. Even spoofed caller ID calls
are being blocked somehow because one of the most commonly blocked calls
is supposedly from The Washington Post and the number on the caller ID
screen is the Post's legitimate phone number. Would the Post try to
call me sometimes 3 or 4 times each day, sometimes with only a 10 minute
interval between calls? Once I even called them to check if they had
any concerns pertaining to my account with them even though I continued
to receive the paper daily and I had not received any recent e-mails
from them even though my e-mail address is part of my account
information. They told me that everything was in order.

Adam H. Kerman

2023-11-27 20:26:16 UTC

. . .

Sorry, I don't know what an "ATA" is.

Analogue telephone adapter
Many (but not all) digital voice services use SIP. Generally, you need a
telephone instrument that incorporates SIP or an ATA for use with an
existing analogue telephone instrument.

You did it again. What is "SIP"?

I never remember that one. Session Initiation Protocol

It's one of the protocols used for telephony in VoIP.

That's not how it works.

They don't need to verify numbers. They are spammers. Automated random
calls are made. If they terminate, they are noted, then the spam calls
are made to the list of phone numbers that can be completed. They aren't
checking that a human answers.

You wouldn't keep two carriers. And since you'd purchase and using an ATA,
you'd be able to use any existing extension in the house. Just make sure
you isolate your inside wiring from outside if you still have a drop from
the phone company.

Post by Retirednoguilt
. . .

Adam H. Kerman

2023-11-26 19:52:01 UTC

. . .

One thing you have to understand about VoIP is that there are multiple
companies involved: Comcast for internet service, the VoIP service
provider, and the CLEC which provides the phone number and network
interconnectivity. The subscriber deals with the VoIP service provider;
they in turn buy service in bulk from the CLEC, which is typically
bandwidth.com.

If you already have a phone number but just want to change service
providers, then take advantage of porting out the number. If you don't
have a phone number, then let the phone number be assigned by the CLEC.

I have two Google Voice numbers that are specific to organizations that
didn't already have phone numbers. I allowed the CLEC to assign numbers.

I also have a VoIP provider. At some point, if Google Voice gives me
lousy service, I'll port out the numbers and port them into my account
at the VoIP provider. It'll barely increase my annual costs, which are
between $75 and $100.

Since you specifically didn't want the new telephone number, you should
have ported out your old number and ported it in to your Google Voice
account. Then they'd have recognized who was calling.

Any type of phone number may be ported out as long as the current phone
service provider participates in number porting. The losing carrier must
have a record of the service address on your account and you must give
this service address to the gaining carrier. The gaining carrier must
find a match in the losing carrier's database, else the port out will be
denied.

Yes, I realize that these days of virtual phone service that "service
address" is meaningless with respect to a phone line being installed and
terminated at a phyical location given that handsets and terminal
adapters are portable and can be used anywhere. Nevertheless, the losing
carrier MUST have a service address in its record of your account. No
one checks that this is the address at which the terminal adapter is
connected to Internet service.

Some rural carriers are exempt from number porting by the state public
utility commission. Cell phone number can usually, but not always, be
ported out. Because a phone number (except for a toll-free number and a
few other exceptions) is tied to telephone switch geography, the gaining
carrier must ALSO be active in the geographic area the original number
was provided in. Typically, that means if you move, almost any number
can be ported from traditional land line to VoIP or cellular, but the
reverse is unlikely to be true.

https://support.google.com/a/answer/13032277

Retirednoguilt

2023-11-27 14:18:55 UTC

. . .

One thing you have to understand about VoIP is that there are multiple
companies involved: Comcast for internet service, the VoIP service
provider, and the CLEC which provides the phone number and network
interconnectivity. The subscriber deals with the VoIP service provider;
they in turn buy service in bulk from the CLEC, which is typically
bandwidth.com.
If you already have a phone number but just want to change service
providers, then take advantage of porting out the number. If you don't
have a phone number, then let the phone number be assigned by the CLEC.
I have two Google Voice numbers that are specific to organizations that
didn't already have phone numbers. I allowed the CLEC to assign numbers.
I also have a VoIP provider. At some point, if Google Voice gives me
lousy service, I'll port out the numbers and port them into my account
at the VoIP provider. It'll barely increase my annual costs, which are
between $75 and $100.
Since you specifically didn't want the new telephone number, you should
have ported out your old number and ported it in to your Google Voice
account. Then they'd have recognized who was calling.
Any type of phone number may be ported out as long as the current phone
service provider participates in number porting. The losing carrier must
have a record of the service address on your account and you must give
this service address to the gaining carrier. The gaining carrier must
find a match in the losing carrier's database, else the port out will be
denied.
Yes, I realize that these days of virtual phone service that "service
address" is meaningless with respect to a phone line being installed and
terminated at a phyical location given that handsets and terminal
adapters are portable and can be used anywhere. Nevertheless, the losing
carrier MUST have a service address in its record of your account. No
one checks that this is the address at which the terminal adapter is
connected to Internet service.
Some rural carriers are exempt from number porting by the state public
utility commission. Cell phone number can usually, but not always, be
ported out. Because a phone number (except for a toll-free number and a
few other exceptions) is tied to telephone switch geography, the gaining
carrier must ALSO be active in the geographic area the original number
was provided in. Typically, that means if you move, almost any number
can be ported from traditional land line to VoIP or cellular, but the
reverse is unlikely to be true.
https://support.google.com/a/answer/13032277

Adam, thanks for the long, detailed explanation. However, sad to say,
almost everything you said went beyond my technical understanding and
I've never heard of a CLEC or what that stands for. All I know is that
I am familiar with porting. When we moved to where we live now, about 7
miles from our previous home, we had a Verizon phone account and wanted
to keep the same landline phone number (at that time we had used that
number for 30 years). However, we also wanted to take advantage of the
steep discount available if we added our phone service to our condo's
bulk double play (TV + internet) contract with Comcast. We were able to
port our number and have continued to use it but now we pay Comcast via
our homeowner's association bulk contract.

*****As a technology lay person, may I please be allowed to make a
generalized request? This is the second time today in this thread that
a responder has used a technical acronym without using the full name it
refers to during the first use of the acronym. Everyone should be aware
that the participants and lurkers in many USENET (originally "Users Unix
Networks) groups have a greatly varied background. We're not all
experts in everything. Please spell out your technical acronyms with
first use in a thread just as I did earlier in the this paragraph when
using the acronym "USENET".*****

Adam H. Kerman

2023-11-27 19:09:47 UTC

. . .

Adam, thanks for the long, detailed explanation. However, sad to say,
almost everything you said went beyond my technical understanding and
I've never heard of a CLEC or what that stands for. . . .

Competitive local exchange carrier

I didn't bother naming it because a long discussion of the various types
of local exchange carriers was irrelevant to the discussion.

dyno dan

2023-11-25 17:09:49 UTC

Post by Frank
Just got our monthly bill, no adjustment for service loss (Peacock and
Netflix) and they charged us $100 for service call

Me too. And I pay a monthly "insurance" fee which is supposed to cover
any service necessary. The problem was caused by original installer,
who did not bury the cable deeply enough. Much of it was above ground
after a few months. They were notified of this several times. Finally
an actual intelligent tech replaced the line and my for-days-after-
heavy-rain total service outages no longer happened. But they still
charged the fee. How about instead refunding part of my monthly money
to compensate for the lack of service time?

-dan z-

--
Protect your civil rights!
Let the politicians know how you feel.
Join or donate to the NRA today!
http://membership.nrahq.org/default.asp?campaignid=XR014887
(use cut and paste to your browser if necessary)

Gun control is like trying to reduce drunk driving by making it tougher for sober people to own cars.

Frank

2023-11-25 18:00:17 UTC